Comments on: “Imamo Hrvatsku!” – MySQL patch which implements full Croatian ordering in utf8_croatian_ci and ucs2_croatian_ci collations https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/ This is a blog from the Nivas.hr crew to the galaxy of unknown. Sun, 12 Jan 2020 11:21:41 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.8.2 By: Elko https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-1161137 Sun, 12 Jan 2020 11:21:41 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-1161137 Sve je ovo jako fino, raduje me da se neko sjetio i balkanskih zemalja i jezika. Ono što je meni nejasno jeste da kad čovjek iz Hr stavi Character set na utf8mb4 i izabere collation utfmb4_croatian_ci ne dobije raspored po hrvatskoj abecedi nego nešto “lijevo”…. da mi je samo zanti koja pametna glava je dala ideju za hrvatski collation po tom fazonu!? Brateee….

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By: seven https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-726640 Thu, 30 Sep 2010 08:47:12 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-726640 sorry kanc, no windows version of server software in nivas. just good old un*x.

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By: kanc https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-726156 Tue, 28 Sep 2010 13:43:11 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-726156 Hi!
Is it possible for you to add link to windows compiled version with this patch?

thanks!

-matija kancijan

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By: shokre https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-685245 Sun, 17 Jan 2010 17:46:30 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-685245 yes this is much better :)

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By: seven https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-684847 Thu, 14 Jan 2010 17:31:23 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-684847 Ma radi, samo sam ja zeznuo dok sam editirao output mysql-a. U shellu kad izvrtim sql ne dobijem hr slova, pa sam editirao. Ovo je raw output, sve radi kako treba. :)

+————–+
| rijec |
+————–+
| Aboriđin |
| Aboriđini |
| Ante |
| Branimir |
| Cipela |
| ÄŚazma |
| Ćevapčići |
| DĹľak |
| dĹľak |
| DĹľamija |
| dĹľamija |
| Đak |
| đak |
| Đevđelija |
| Inat |
| Init |
| Inozemstvo |
| Interes |
| Injekcija |
| Ipsilon |
| Kutina |
| Livno |
| Lovor |
| Ljubav |
| Ljubljana |
| Neven |
| Nivas |
| Nosorog |
| Njivice |
| Onomatopeja |
| Šišmiš |
| Zagreb |
| Žaba |
+————–+
33 rows in set (0.00 sec)

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By: shokre https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-684632 Tue, 12 Jan 2010 15:38:08 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-684632 Ovaj proof-of-concept neradi.
Kutina se pojavljuje 2 puta nakon Đevđelija i nakon Ipsilon.

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By: seven https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-679189 Thu, 03 Dec 2009 01:41:45 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-679189 lang=hr

Ekipa matematičari, ovo sa INJEKCIJA je otišlo u krivom smjeru. :)

Ja nisam jezikoslovac, ne bavim se fonetikom, niti sam profesor hrvatskog jezika, stoga nikako ne želim navući bijes istih.

– PISMO –

Hrvatska abeceda, hrvatska latinica ili Gajica (po Ljudevitu Gaju) je latinično pismo namijenjeno za pisanje hrvatskog jezika. Sadrži 30 slova, 27 ih se piše pomoću jednoga znaka (jednoslovi), a 3 pomoću dva znaka (dvoslovi / dvostruka slova / digrafi) – lj, nj i dž.

Gaj je preuzeo iz češkog Ň koje je postalo NJ, sa slovačkog Ľ koje je zamijenilo LJ, te poljsko slovo Ǧ koje je zamijenjeno sa DŽ.

– PRAVOPIS –

Hrvatski pravopis poznaje nekoliko glasovnih promjena. Jedna (nama interesantna ovdje) jotovanje ili jotacija je glasovna promjena zadužena za spajanje nepalatalnih suglasnika c, d, g, h, k, l, n, s, t i z s glasom j, pri čemu se tvore palatalni suglasnici č, đ, ž, š, lj, nj i ć.

Jotovanje ima svoja pravila i izuzetke, no koliko ja znam lj i nj ne podliježu niti jednom pravopisnom izuzetku.

Govorni jezik izlazi iz okvira hrvatskog pravopisa i zavisno o dijalektu ima svoje varijacije jotovanja (novo, novije, najnovije, ijekavsko…).

Pogledao sam u par hrvatskih rječnika i postoji samo 1 riječ u hrvatskom jeziku (posuđenica) – injèkcija (ž) (lat. injicere: umetnuti, ubaciti) i može imati značenje za:
– ubrizgavanje
– tekućinu koja se ubrizgava
– sprava kojom se ubrizgava
– snažan potisak
– matematička funkcija

U knjiškom izgovoru je injekcija a uobičajeno se izgovara ińekcija. Niti u jednom jeziku slovo (grafem) ne mora odgovarati glasu (fonemu).

Morfemska raščlamba nije in-jekcij-a, nego injekcij-a. Nemamo riječ ‘jekcija’.

Stoga, tvrdim i dalje da se injekcija piše sa nj. :)

Ako sam u krivu, molim vas ispravite.

I za kraj složio bih se s Antom (ako već ne oko injekcije) oko činjenica da je najveći neprijatelj hrvatskog jezika u modernom dobu računala i baza podataka činjenica da nemamo tipkovnice sa slovima LJ, NJ i DŽ. 

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By: Haris https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-679108 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 16:04:30 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-679108 Nice job :)

@Zlatko – nemoj biti nesretan, ovo je skroz ok.

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By: Zlatko https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-679103 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 15:27:08 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-679103 s tim da ce se tesko jezik mijenjati da izbaci digrafe… ali eto. barem nesto…

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By: Ante https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-679060 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 08:33:50 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-679060 Zlatko moze biti i jedno i drugo :) Jedno je mat. funkcija, drugo je sprica. Zato sortiranje nece biti ispravno sve dok ne budemo unasali ‘nj’, a ne ‘n’ i ‘j’.

S druge strane, razgovarao sam sa lingvisticarem i rekao je da to i nije takav problem jer se radi o 30ak rijeci.

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By: Zlatko https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678981 Tue, 01 Dec 2009 18:16:04 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678981 S tim da je “nj” u injekcija zapravo n i j, a ne nj… :S

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By: seven https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678949 Tue, 01 Dec 2009 11:41:23 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678949 Yo Kurt! Welcome to our blog! OMG black vodka sounds absynthish. :) We must organize schnapps session when you come to our neighbourhood.

Ante: Added “Lovor” & “Nosorog” to blogpost, test dump and test results. I got carried away with your “Injekcija” yesterday so I missed couple of examples.

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By: Ante https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678911 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 23:03:52 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678911 Btw… Ovaj ‘proof of concept’ ne dokazuje nista po pitanju Nj i Lj. Dodaj jos ‘Lovor’ i ‘Nosorog’.

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By: Ante https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678909 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 22:53:16 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678909 One more note… MariaDB 5.1 which will be released very soon will support all of this. So, if you need better MySQL than MySQL – go MariaDB! http://askmonty.org/wiki/index.php/MariaDB

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By: Kurt von Finck https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678908 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 22:52:42 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678908 Sorry, but it wasn’t rakija.

It was salmiakkikossu, Finnish black vodka.

But yes, liquor is one of the best lubricants for the software development machine. :)

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By: Ante https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678905 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 22:24:50 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678905 Haha something like that, yes :) It wasn’t rakija, it was beer and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pisco :D And wouldn’t said druk, we just had a nice chat during the last evening at the Ubuntu Developer Summit (free alcohol) :)

As for 5.0 patch… It does work; it passed all tests and there is no logical reason why it wouldn’t work.

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By: Sinke https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678895 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 20:39:56 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678895 And they say drinking is bad for you!!! :)
Hats off to you fellas!

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By: Emil Mustac https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678879 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:29:49 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678879 Great news!

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By: Ivan Nikolic https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678868 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 16:49:34 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678868 Restekpa! :)

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By: Mario Frančešević https://www.nivas.hr/blog/2009/11/30/imamo-hrvatsku-mysql-patch-which-implements-full-croatian-ordering-in-utf8_croatian_ci-and-ucs2_croatian_ci-collations/comment-page-1/#comment-678861 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 15:30:59 +0000 https://www.nivas.hr/blog/?p=1534#comment-678861 Respect! Quite a story I must say :) Good old rakija wins again :D

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